[time-nuts] Quad Driven Mixer 5 to 10 MHz Doubler Atricle

[Dave M]

I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not the
article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the article. The
only files in the download are the XLS file for calculating the filter
values, and the parts list.

It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings, filename
3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a Low
Spurious Frequency Doubler"

Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

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[Don Latham]

It's interesting. I took the hint, and tried sin(a)*sin(b) expand and set
b=a+pi/2. fun fun fun.
All that's needed in theory is a mixer and a pi/2 phase shifter at 5 MHz.
Probably a bunch of other stuff because of real parts :-) Minicircuits will
sell you one, packaged, for about 50 rasbucknicks.
Don

Dave M

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not the
article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the article. The
only files in the download are the XLS file for calculating the filter
values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings, filename
3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a Low
Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

--
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who
have not got it."
-George Bernard Shaw

Dr. Don Latham AJ7LL
Six Mile Systems LLC
17850 Six Mile Road
Huson, MT, 59846
mail: POBox 404
Frenchtown MT 59834-0404
VOX 406-626-4304
Skype: buffler2
www.lightningforensics.com
www.sixmilesystems.com


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[Dave Daniel]

I believe I have a PDF copy of the article if anyone wants it. It's
about 1.3 MB in size.

DaveD

Post by Don Latham
It's interesting. I took the hint, and tried sin(a)*sin(b) expand and set
b=a+pi/2. fun fun fun.
All that's needed in theory is a mixer and a pi/2 phase shifter at 5 MHz.
Probably a bunch of other stuff because of real parts :-) Minicircuits will
sell you one, packaged, for about 50 rasbucknicks.
Don
Dave M

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not the
article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the article. The
only files in the download are the XLS file for calculating the filter
values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings, filename
3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a Low
Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

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[Alan Melia]

As a subscriber to QEX I saw this article but thought that the "bi-phase
rectifier" was a lot easier and has be well characterised by the
"time-nuts" experts. Now it has shown up here I would be interested to hear
from those experimenting how badly the NE602 performs compared with a
passive DBM for "nuts-style" applications :-)) I have a pile of kit with
5MHz VCXOs (Racal and Marconi) including an excellent GPSDO by Rapco.

Alan
G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Daniel" <***@gmail.com>
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"
<time-***@febo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2014 10:36 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Quad Driven Mixer 5 to 10 MHz Doubler Atricle

I believe I have a PDF copy of the article if anyone wants it. It's about
1.3 MB in size.
DaveD

Post by Don Latham
It's interesting. I took the hint, and tried sin(a)*sin(b) expand and set
b=a+pi/2. fun fun fun.
All that's needed in theory is a mixer and a pi/2 phase shifter at 5 MHz.
Probably a bunch of other stuff because of real parts :-) Minicircuits will
sell you one, packaged, for about 50 rasbucknicks.
Don
Dave M

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not the
article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the article.
The
only files in the download are the XLS file for calculating the filter
values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings, filename
3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a Low
Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

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To unsubscribe, go to
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[Oz-in-DFW]

Only a small subset of QEX articles on available in digital format. This
isn't one of them. We'll either need to get a copy from the author, or
from a QEX subscriber.

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a
Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

--
mailto:***@ozindfw.net
Oz
POB 93167
Southlake, TX 76092 (Near DFW Airport)



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[Charles Steinmetz]

It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but useful.

Indeed it is. I designed a similar one using a quadrature hybrid
splitter and level 7 mixer, and it's almost scary how well it
works. It's as cute as a regenerative divide by two using a DBM.

Best regards,

Charles



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[Charles Steinmetz]

Post by Brian, WA1ZMS
Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier"
design with a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.

The advantage of the multiplier circuit is that the signal straight
out of the mixer has excellent harmonic and 5MHz suppression. In my
circuit with the quadrature hybrid, 5MHz feedthrough is less than
-45dBc and the most prominent harmonic (30MHz) is less than
-30dBc. The visible spurs are all odd harmonics of the 10MHz output,
so the signal is symmetrical and for many uses does not need any
further filtering. I generally use a 2-pole active filter that
reduces the 30MHz to better than -55dBc, and if I need to get crazy I
can add a simple series LC at the output to get the 30MHz below
-70dBc. This strategy minimizes the risk of temperature-dependent
phase shift from the steep filter that would be necessary to reduce
the spurs to those levels following a diode doubler.

Best regards,

Charles



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[Charles Steinmetz]

For those who may be curious, I dug out the schematic for my version
of the quadrature-driven DBM frequency doubler and posted it to
ko4bb.com. It uses a quadrature hybrid coupler to generate +45 and
-45 degree signals at 5MHz, buffers them with emitter followers, and
applies them to the RF and LO inputs of a Level 7 DBM. The file name
is "Frequency doubler quadrature DBM" (it should be searchable once
it is moved out of the recent upload directory).

Due to the excellent balance of the quadrature hybrid coupler and the
DBM, the spurious products in the mixer output are all odd-order
harmonics of 10MHz, the strongest being 30MHz at about -35dBc. The
5MHz feedthrough is about -50dBc. Note that these depend on the
mixer balance and circuit layout, as well as the quadrature coupler
design and construction.

Also shown is an active filter/amplifier that brings the 10MHz output
back up near 1Vrms and lowers the 30MHz harmonic to ~ -60dBc and the
5MHz feedthrough to ~ -65dBc. If a simple series LC is used to feed
the load, H3 and 5MHz feedthrough can be reduced further to ~ -80dBc.

Bandpass filters at the output frequency can create phase modulation
with temperature changes. Accordingly, they are presumptively
disfavored. However, I built the whole circuit into a smallish cast
aluminum box, which integrates any external temperature changes with
a long time constant (tens of minutes), and have never had any
problem in this regard.

For many applications there is no need for any filtering (other than
a simple LP noise filter) after the mixer. Because the even-order
output products are very well suppressed, the output waveform is
nearly perfectly symmetrical. This means that it has a 50% duty
cycle and maintains its 50% duty cycle when it is AC coupled or
DC-restored, so triggering can always be stable at the center point
of the waveform.

This inherent freedom from spurious outputs and suppression of
even-order output harmonics makes the circuit attractive wherever low
spurious output is desired, compared to diode doublers or active
push-push circuits. For any required suppression of spurs, the DBM
doubler needs less aggressive filtering because of its inherent
balance. It also avoids the flicker noise that is characteristic of
diode, BJT, and FET doublers.

Of course, any design is an exercise in compromise and meeting
required performance goals, and there are always many means to reach
the end, so different designers will choose different paths. This is
one I happen to like. If you try it, you may find that you do, too.

Note: The circuit works without the emitter follower buffers, but
the spurious outputs are somewhat higher due to the nonlinear loading
on the hybrid coupler. This may still be useful if an all-passive
circuit is required.

Best regards,

Charles


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[Brian, WA1ZMS]

Gentlemen-

I have my paper copy in front of me with the original article.
I am not certain that I can just scan it and send it around due to
ARRL & Author copyright matters. But I am willing to scan it.

With all due respect to John, K6IQL the author who spent much time
on his design......I would opine that an equivalent doubler could be
made from the Wenzel doubler circuits that are on the Wenzel web
page and from first-hand experience...I used such a 5-to-10 MHz doubler
for all of my amateur radio projects up through 403GHz.

The K6IQL design, in brief, splits the 5MHz signal into two paths.
One passes to the LO port of a Double Balanced mixer, while the
second path goes through a 90-deg phase shift network and into the
RF port of that JMS-1MH mixer. The output is taken from the IF
port. The output is then buffered & filtered. He spent much design effort
on the 90-deg phase shift network to keep it all temp stable.

Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier" design with
a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.

-Brian, WA1ZMS/4


-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-***@febo.com] On Behalf Of Oz-in-DFW
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2014 4:41 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Quad Driven Mixer 5 to 10 MHz Doubler Atricle

Only a small subset of QEX articles on available in digital format. This isn't one of them. We'll either need to get a copy from the author, or from a QEX subscriber.

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency
Standard to 10 MHz with a Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the article.
None of them were able to download much or anything from the ARRL QEX
web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So hang
in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but useful.
Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

--
mailto:***@ozindfw.net
Oz
POB 93167
Southlake, TX 76092 (Near DFW Airport)



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[paul swed]

I also appreciate the Wenzel circuit. Not seeing the other article, I might
guess that maybe it offers suppression of the original 5 MHz signal as a
benefit.
It seems to be the equivalent of a digital XOR circuit with one lead
delayed by 90 degrees.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

Post by Brian, WA1ZMS
Gentlemen-
I have my paper copy in front of me with the original article.
I am not certain that I can just scan it and send it around due to
ARRL & Author copyright matters. But I am willing to scan it.
With all due respect to John, K6IQL the author who spent much time
on his design......I would opine that an equivalent doubler could be
made from the Wenzel doubler circuits that are on the Wenzel web
page and from first-hand experience...I used such a 5-to-10 MHz doubler
for all of my amateur radio projects up through 403GHz.
The K6IQL design, in brief, splits the 5MHz signal into two paths.
One passes to the LO port of a Double Balanced mixer, while the
second path goes through a 90-deg phase shift network and into the
RF port of that JMS-1MH mixer. The output is taken from the IF
port. The output is then buffered & filtered. He spent much design effort
on the 90-deg phase shift network to keep it all temp stable.
Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier" design with
a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.
-Brian, WA1ZMS/4
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2014 4:41 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Quad Driven Mixer 5 to 10 MHz Doubler Atricle
Only a small subset of QEX articles on available in digital format. This
isn't one of them. We'll either need to get a copy from the author, or from
a QEX subscriber.

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency
Standard to 10 MHz with a Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the article.
None of them were able to download much or anything from the ARRL QEX
web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So hang
in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but useful.
Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

--
Oz
POB 93167
Southlake, TX 76092 (Near DFW Airport)
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[Dave M]

Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel 2-diode
doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode doubler,
just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China), item#
171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture in the
listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At $9.99 USD,
the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA connectors on both
ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA connectors if you
want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but I'll
bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any trouble
handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency ferrite for
the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to get
the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.

Dave M

Post by Brian, WA1ZMS
Gentlemen-
I have my paper copy in front of me with the original article.
I am not certain that I can just scan it and send it around due to
ARRL & Author copyright matters. But I am willing to scan it.
With all due respect to John, K6IQL the author who spent much time
on his design......I would opine that an equivalent doubler could be
made from the Wenzel doubler circuits that are on the Wenzel web
page and from first-hand experience...I used such a 5-to-10 MHz doubler
for all of my amateur radio projects up through 403GHz.
The K6IQL design, in brief, splits the 5MHz signal into two paths.
One passes to the LO port of a Double Balanced mixer, while the
second path goes through a 90-deg phase shift network and into the
RF port of that JMS-1MH mixer. The output is taken from the IF
port. The output is then buffered & filtered. He spent much design effort
on the 90-deg phase shift network to keep it all temp stable.
Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier" design with
a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.
-Brian, WA1ZMS/4

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To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

[Bob Camp]

Hi

The Wenzel doubler has a bit of “stuff” in the middle of the bridge. It’s tuned a bit to give it best performance at a specific frequency. It’s not narrowband, but it is not a 2:1 bandwidth.

Bob

Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel 2-diode doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode doubler, just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China), item# 171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture in the listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At $9.99 USD, the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA connectors on both ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA connectors if you want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but I'll bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any trouble handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency ferrite for the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to get the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M

Post by Brian, WA1ZMS
Gentlemen-
I have my paper copy in front of me with the original article.
I am not certain that I can just scan it and send it around due to
ARRL & Author copyright matters. But I am willing to scan it.
With all due respect to John, K6IQL the author who spent much time
on his design......I would opine that an equivalent doubler could be
made from the Wenzel doubler circuits that are on the Wenzel web
page and from first-hand experience...I used such a 5-to-10 MHz doubler
for all of my amateur radio projects up through 403GHz.
The K6IQL design, in brief, splits the 5MHz signal into two paths.
One passes to the LO port of a Double Balanced mixer, while the
second path goes through a 90-deg phase shift network and into the
RF port of that JMS-1MH mixer. The output is taken from the IF
port. The output is then buffered & filtered. He spent much design effort
on the 90-deg phase shift network to keep it all temp stable.
Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier" design with
a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.
-Brian, WA1ZMS/4

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To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

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[paul swed]

Looked it up and pretty amazing. Can't really say how well the ferrite will
go down to 5. It should.
Paul
WB8TSL

Post by Dave M
Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel
2-diode doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode
doubler, just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China),
item# 171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture
in the listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At
$9.99 USD, the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA
connectors on both ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA
connectors if you want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but
I'll bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any
trouble handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency
ferrite for the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to
get the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M

Post by Brian, WA1ZMS
Gentlemen-
I have my paper copy in front of me with the original article.
I am not certain that I can just scan it and send it around due to
ARRL & Author copyright matters. But I am willing to scan it.
With all due respect to John, K6IQL the author who spent much time
on his design......I would opine that an equivalent doubler could be
made from the Wenzel doubler circuits that are on the Wenzel web
page and from first-hand experience...I used such a 5-to-10 MHz doubler
for all of my amateur radio projects up through 403GHz.
The K6IQL design, in brief, splits the 5MHz signal into two paths.
One passes to the LO port of a Double Balanced mixer, while the
second path goes through a 90-deg phase shift network and into the
RF port of that JMS-1MH mixer. The output is taken from the IF
port. The output is then buffered & filtered. He spent much design effort
on the 90-deg phase shift network to keep it all temp stable.
Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier" design with
a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.
-Brian, WA1ZMS/4

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mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

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[Bob Camp]

Hi

In the “as wired” configuration, that looks more like a full wave doubler than the full Wenzel tuned multiplier. You may be able to re-wire it for the full circuit.

Bob

Post by paul swed
Looked it up and pretty amazing. Can't really say how well the ferrite will
go down to 5. It should.
Paul
WB8TSL

Post by Dave M
Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel
2-diode doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode
doubler, just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China),
item# 171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture
in the listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At
$9.99 USD, the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA
connectors on both ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA
connectors if you want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but
I'll bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any
trouble handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency
ferrite for the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to
get the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M

Post by Brian, WA1ZMS
Gentlemen-
I have my paper copy in front of me with the original article.
I am not certain that I can just scan it and send it around due to
ARRL & Author copyright matters. But I am willing to scan it.
With all due respect to John, K6IQL the author who spent much time
on his design......I would opine that an equivalent doubler could be
made from the Wenzel doubler circuits that are on the Wenzel web
page and from first-hand experience...I used such a 5-to-10 MHz doubler
for all of my amateur radio projects up through 403GHz.
The K6IQL design, in brief, splits the 5MHz signal into two paths.
One passes to the LO port of a Double Balanced mixer, while the
second path goes through a 90-deg phase shift network and into the
RF port of that JMS-1MH mixer. The output is taken from the IF
port. The output is then buffered & filtered. He spent much design effort
on the 90-deg phase shift network to keep it all temp stable.
Personally, I'm lazy and like the Wenzel "full wave rectifier" design with
a nice BPF on the output to obtain a clean 10MHz.
-Brian, WA1ZMS/4

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[Jim Sanford]

I'm a member, and the article is not there -- just the Excel spreadsheet
and a Word document of the parts list.
Too bad, I have a handful of 5 MHzx TCXOs.
I may have hardcopy of the issue, will have to dig for it.

Jim

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a
Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

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[Don Latham]

I digitized the first 2011 article to hand, the one in Jan-Feb; it's a smaller
article, and not as elegant as the later one. Anyone interested can email me
off-list. You're allowed to have a copy for your own use, just can't
re-publish.
Don

Jim Sanford

Post by Jim Sanford
I'm a member, and the article is not there -- just the Excel spreadsheet
and a Word document of the parts list.
Too bad, I have a handful of 5 MHzx TCXOs.
I may have hardcopy of the issue, will have to dig for it.
Jim

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a
Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

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--
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who
have not got it."
-George Bernard Shaw

Dr. Don Latham AJ7LL
Six Mile Systems LLC
17850 Six Mile Road
Huson, MT, 59846
mail: POBox 404
Frenchtown MT 59834-0404
VOX 406-626-4304
Skype: buffler2
www.lightningforensics.com
www.sixmilesystems.com


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[Graham]

I would like a copy of the article please.

Post by Don Latham
I digitized the first 2011 article to hand, the one in Jan-Feb; it's a smaller
article, and not as elegant as the later one. Anyone interested can email me
off-list. You're allowed to have a copy for your own use, just can't
re-publish.
Don
Jim Sanford

Post by Jim Sanford
I'm a member, and the article is not there -- just the Excel spreadsheet
and a Word document of the parts list.
Too bad, I have a handful of 5 MHzx TCXOs.
I may have hardcopy of the issue, will have to dig for it.
Jim

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a
Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

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[Dave Daniel]

Is that the "A Two Diode Frequency Doubler" article by John Pivnichny?

DaveD

Post by Don Latham
I digitized the first 2011 article to hand, the one in Jan-Feb; it's a smaller
article, and not as elegant as the later one. Anyone interested can email me
off-list. You're allowed to have a copy for your own use, just can't
re-publish.
Don
Jim Sanford

Post by Jim Sanford
I'm a member, and the article is not there -- just the Excel spreadsheet
and a Word document of the parts list.
Too bad, I have a handful of 5 MHzx TCXOs.
I may have hardcopy of the issue, will have to dig for it.
Jim

Post by Dave M
I am able to download the files associated with the article, but not
the article itself. Guess I need to be a paying member to get the
article. The only files in the download are the XLS file for
calculating the filter values, and the parts list.
It's at http://www.arrl.org/qexfiles in the year 2011 listings,
filename 3x11_Roos.zip
titled "Converting a Vintage 5 MHz Frequency Standard to 10 MHz with a
Low Spurious Frequency Doubler"
Dave M

Several list members contacted me expressing interest in the
article. None of them were able to download much or anything
from the ARRL QEX web site. That includes me and other ARRL members.
I am working the issue with one call to ARRL so far today. I will
contact Larry Wolfgang at ARRL and see what Ican bust loose. So
hang in there. It is a cute technique, not originated by me, but
useful. Right now I have to get the ARRL FMT done first.
-73 john c roos k6iql

_______________________________________________
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https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
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[t***@timeok.it]

Hi all,

I can suggest a different solution I have tested to have some important improvement. First, the lower phase shift sensitivity with the use of a low pass filter in conjunction with two notch filters instead the high Q band pass filter, second the unity gain to avoid a 13/20 dB amplifier to restore the original power level. You can find in the link all the test we have done.

http://www.timeok.it/files/high_performance_frequency_doublerv13.pdf

I hope this can hep.

Luciano
www.timeok.it

We are using Wenzel with two filters see attached if it will pass. 20 Mhz
is down more than 60 db and 5 MHz 55. Distribution Amp takes care of the
rest.
Bert Kehren
In a message dated 11/12/2014 8:13:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel
2-diode
doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode doubler,
just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China), item#
171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture in the
listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At $9.99
USD,
the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA connectors on both
ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA connectors if you
want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but
I'll
bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any trouble
handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency ferrite for
the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to
get
the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M
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[xaos]

Luciano,

This looks very nice. However, the inductors are
custom made. It would be nice to have a
off the shelf parts solution so it can be made
easily.

Any ideas ?

-George, N2FGX

Post by t***@timeok.it
Hi all,
I can suggest a different solution I have tested to have some important improvement. First, the lower phase shift sensitivity with the use of a low pass filter in conjunction with two notch filters instead the high Q band pass filter, second the unity gain to avoid a 13/20 dB amplifier to restore the original power level. You can find in the link all the test we have done.
http://www.timeok.it/files/high_performance_frequency_doublerv13.pdf
I hope this can hep.
Luciano
www.timeok.it

We are using Wenzel with two filters see attached if it will pass. 20 Mhz
is down more than 60 db and 5 MHz 55. Distribution Amp takes care of the
rest.
Bert Kehren
In a message dated 11/12/2014 8:13:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel
2-diode
doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode doubler,
just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China), item#
171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture in the
listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At $9.99
USD,
the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA connectors on both
ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA connectors if you
want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but
I'll
bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any trouble
handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency ferrite for
the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to
get
the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M
_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe, go to
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_______________________________________________
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[t***@timeok.it]

George,

you can replace the input transformer with the mini-circuits model T2-613-1-KK81 or T662-KK81 for under 2 Dollars. The inductors L1 and L3 are standards value you can find smd or standard on ebay. About L4 you can put in place a standard 4.7uH value increasing the series capacitor for the 5MHz notching.The 3.18uH is critical because it has the double function of low pass filter and impedance adapter, so I suggest to made it as described or using a smaller core.

Luciano

Post by xaos
Luciano,
This looks very nice. However, the inductors are
custom made. It would be nice to have a
off the shelf parts solution so it can be made
easily.
Any ideas ?
-George, N2FGX

Post by t***@timeok.it
Hi all,
I can suggest a different solution I have tested to have some important

improvement. First, the lower phase shift sensitivity with the use of a low
pass filter in conjunction with two notch filters instead the high Q band
pass filter, second the unity gain to avoid a 13/20 dB amplifier to restore
the original power level. You can find in the link all the test we have
done.

Post by t***@timeok.it
http://www.timeok.it/files/high_performance_frequency_doublerv13.pdf [1]
I hope this can hep.
Luciano
www.timeok.it [2]

We are using Wenzel with two filters see attached if it will pass. 20

Mhz

Post by t***@timeok.it

is down more than 60 db and 5 MHz 55. Distribution Amp takes care of

the

Post by t***@timeok.it

rest.
Bert Kehren
In a message dated 11/12/2014 8:13:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel
2-diode
doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode

doubler,

Post by t***@timeok.it

just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China), item#
171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture in

the

Post by t***@timeok.it

listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At $9.99
USD,
the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA connectors on

both

Post by t***@timeok.it

ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA connectors if

you

Post by t***@timeok.it

want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but
I'll
bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any trouble
handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency ferrite

for

Post by t***@timeok.it

the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to
get
the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M
_______________________________________________
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[xaos]

Luciano,

I will put this in OrCAD/CADENCE PSPICE over the weekend
and see what it looks like.

-George

Post by xaos
George,
you can replace the input transformer with the mini-circuits model T2-613-1-KK81 or T662-KK81 for under 2 Dollars. The inductors L1 and L3 are standards value you can find smd or standard on ebay. About L4 you can put in place a standard 4.7uH value increasing the series capacitor for the 5MHz notching.The 3.18uH is critical because it has the double function of low pass filter and impedance adapter, so I suggest to made it as described or using a smaller core.
Luciano

Post by xaos
Luciano,
This looks very nice. However, the inductors are
custom made. It would be nice to have a
off the shelf parts solution so it can be made
easily.
Any ideas ?
-George, N2FGX

Post by t***@timeok.it
Hi all,
I can suggest a different solution I have tested to have some important

improvement. First, the lower phase shift sensitivity with the use of a low
pass filter in conjunction with two notch filters instead the high Q band
pass filter, second the unity gain to avoid a 13/20 dB amplifier to restore
the original power level. You can find in the link all the test we have
done.

Post by t***@timeok.it
http://www.timeok.it/files/high_performance_frequency_doublerv13.pdf [1]
I hope this can hep.
Luciano
www.timeok.it [2]

We are using Wenzel with two filters see attached if it will pass. 20

Mhz

Post by t***@timeok.it

is down more than 60 db and 5 MHz 55. Distribution Amp takes care of

the

Post by t***@timeok.it

rest.
Bert Kehren
In a message dated 11/12/2014 8:13:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Just a few days ago, I ordered parts to build a couple of the Wenzel
2-diode
doublers, described in the same article as your full-wave diode

doubler,

Post by t***@timeok.it

just in time to discover them on Ebay (via slow boat from China), item#
171511157159. I inspected the components and layout in the picture in

the

Post by t***@timeok.it

listing, and it certainly looks like the Wenzel FWB doubler. At $9.99
USD,
the price is cheap enough, especially since you get SMA connectors on

both

Post by t***@timeok.it

ends. Might have to do a bit of solder work on the SMA connectors if

you

Post by t***@timeok.it

want to put it into a little box.
The listing on the doubler on Ebay says that the low end is 10MHz, but
I'll
bet that it will get down to 5MHz quite easily If there's any trouble
handling a 5MHz input, you could easily use a lower frequency ferrite

for

Post by t***@timeok.it

the balun and make it work.
As you suggest, a BPF on the output and maybe a bit of amplification to
get
the level up to a usable level should get you a fairly clean 10 MHz.
Dave M
_______________________________________________
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